What is a Bitcoin ATM - How to Use It and Where to Find ...

I offered to help my friend spread the word about their Bitcoin ATM finder's fee. Seems like a great way to spread Bitcoin awareness and make some money. Contact them for more details.
Who are we?

Coincloud is a fast growing Bitcoin ATM company that provides Bitcoin teller machines in convenient locations for consumers to buy and sell bitcoins. We have over 40 BTMs in various businesses throughout 7 states. We plan to continue expanding across the U.S by deploying new terminals to meet the growing customer demand.

What we are looking for?

We are looking for enterprising individuals to help us secure new locations for our BTMs.
We are interested in businesses at key metro areas, within stores that are open late or 24 hours a day. We want these to be centrally located and easily accessible.
Preferred cities are Portland, Minneapolis, Tucson, Rochester, Hartford, Bridgeport, Providence, Pittsburgh, San Jose, Louisville, Oklahoma City, Columbus, Austin, Orlando, Houston, San Diego, Boston, Charlotte, Richmond, Memphis, Jacksonville, Denver
The finder’s fee for securing a new locations with a 5 year contract is $1,000.

Why would a business owner want an BTM installed inside their building?

A rent payment of $350 / month (prorated for non 24hr locations) or $1 per transaction
Free advertising and foot traffic to the location through www.coinatmradar.com and our BTM specific advertising.
Our BTM has a 2x2 floor print. It is installed and managed by us. All the store needs to do is provide power and internet. And all you need to do is convince them to do so!

Please contact us for any additional details, we will get back to you quickly. We look forward to working with you.
All locations are vetted and picked at our discretion
Contact: [email protected]

Started seeing some bitcoin ATMs in local stores. The machines were from different companies and had different fees. Which made me wonder what goes into people's decision on what machine to use.
Is mostly just how much the fee is? Also I was checking coinatmradar and most of the machines around me do not have the fees posted online so how do you know your getting a good fee?
Do you consider other things:
- Location (is it near me)
- Company (maybe one company is more trusted than another, better customer service)
- How much ID you need at the machine (upto $1000 with sms versus unto $1500)

[ 🔴 DELETED 🔴 ] Topic originally posted in Bitcoin by PayDepot [link]

NEW Pay Depot Bitcoin ATMs at Home Town Market - New Jersey
Check out Home Town Market to get the lowest possible transaction fees when you buy or sell your cryptocurrency with Pay Depot.
Bitcoin ATMs at Home Town Market in New Jersey LOCATIONS LIST:
1000 Route 70, Lakewood, NJ 08701
Google Map Link: https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1jYSOlrmndtbeOL43qGUzqJwoBcS27pYF&usp=sharing
https://i.redd.it/zuptew7gd7i51.gif
For Support, You can Email us [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected])
Price = Current market price
Limit = $800/$3000 Daily
ID: Required for Purchases over $800
-------------------------------------------------------------
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or
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PayDepot your post has been copied because one or more comments in this topic have been removed. This copy will preserve unmoderated topic. If you would like to opt-out, please send a message using [this link].

'''
NEW Pay Depot Bitcoin ATMs at Home Town Market - New Jersey
Check out Home Town Market to get the lowest possible transaction fees when you buy or sell your cryptocurrency with Pay Depot.
Bitcoin ATMs at Home Town Market in New Jersey LOCATIONS LIST:
[1000 Route 70, Lakewood, NJ 08701]^¹
Google Map Link: [[link]^⁷
[link]^⁸
For Support, You can Email us [[email protected]]^³
Price = Current market price
Limit = $800/$3000 Daily
ID: Required for Purchases over $800
-------------------------------------------------------------
FOLLOW US
[[link]^⁹
or
[[link]^¹⁰
To Get the Latest Location and Promotional Event News [[link]^¹¹
'''
NEW 1 Pay Depot Bitcoin ATMs at Home Town Market - New Jersey
Go1dfish undelete link
unreddit undelete link
Author: PayDepot
1: www.go*gl*.com/m*ps/d/*dit?mid***YSO****dtbeO*43q*UzqJwoBc**7*YF*amp;usp=*h*ri*g 2: *ww*g**gl*.com/*aps/d/ed*t?m*d*1jYSOlrmndtbe*L43*GUzqJwoBc*27***&*usp=s***i*g 3: mailto:[email protected] 4: t*itter*co*/A*M_*ear*Me 5: **w*facebook.com*A*M*Bitco*n 6: p*ydep*t.com* 7: *ww*goo**e.com/ma*s/d*e*it?*i*=1j*S*lrmnd**eOL4*qGU*qJwoBcS27*YF*amp*usp=sha*ing]**2 8: *.*edd*it/z*p*ew7gd7i5*.gi* 9: tw*tt**.com/AT*\*Near\_Me]^** 10: *ww.f*cebook.co*/ATM**i***in]^^5 11: *ay*e*ot.c*m]^^6
Unknown links are censored to prevent spreading illicit content.

Welcome again to another recap and the first full week of the new month after breaking the downward trend on the monthly!

Firstly, from last weeks uptrend we have seen the market consolidate at this level throughout the week with a steady upward climb at the start of the week to a balance out above $11.5k for Bitcoin towards the end. For the market we have a total increase of $17.5B over the week but a 1% decrease of btc dominance moving mainly toward Chainlink and other altcoins.

Bitcoin (BTC) pushes up to $12k again, -1.3% this week.
Ethereum (ETH) pushed up to $400 again, up 0.2% this week.
Chainlink (LINK) currently at $13.51, up 58% this week.
Ethereum classic (ETC) at $6.93, -12% this week. However they have had their second successful 51% attack.
Cardano (ADA) at $0.14 and steady at 0.4% this week.
IOTA at $0.35 and up 10% this week.

Closing the week we have had some altcoin action, Ethereum breaking $400 midweek but now staying back in a nice channel between $350-$410 since the start of August. But, Chainlink killing it after breaking $10 and currently sitting comfortably above $13!! Other altcoins that have reaped rewards and I'm keeping an eye on are:

1 Band Protocol, up 283%/7days. Currently $15.91
Tezos, up 26%/7 days. Currently $3.62USD
VeChain, up 29.8%/7 days. Currently $0.02USD
Compound, up 36%/7days . Currently $172.09USD
Ren, up 49%/7days. Currently $0.27USD
Swipe, up 44.8%/7days. Currently $2.48
Balancer, up 135%/7days. Currently $24.47
8 Ocean Protocol, up 87%/7days. Currently $0.41
9 Kava, up 94%/7days. Currently $4.57

I have picked these as i have noticed they are usually the first movers or the biggest gainers after the market goes red. Chasing those quick gains!

What about the news for this week?

Ethereum Classic suffers from another 51% attack. The attacker makes off with over $5.6M worth of ETC.
Wall street wants in on cryptocurrencies as Bitcoin and Ethereum have been the best performing assets, currently over 90% of all circulating Ethereum is now in a state of profit.
Bitcoin Cash infighting about its Difficulty Adjustment Algorithm (DAA). Possible fork to come called "Bitcoin Cat".
More Crypto adoption happening in the world: Over 1000 Location accept crypto in Slovenia, Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies are talked on the Joe Rogan podcast, almost 9000 Bitcoin ATM locations worldwide in addition to this 211,245 non ATMs. https://coinatmradar.com/,
According to Chainalysis, East Asia is the most active in the world in regard to cryptocurrency volume moved onchain. However, North America purchases and hold more bitcoin than any other region.
Bitcoin averaged over 1 million daily active addresses in the past week since Jan 2018. Ethereum averages 620 thousand active addresses in this period but transaction fees continue to rise, averaging $2M worth of daily fees.
Bitmain cofounders still in contention. Bitcoin mining equipment is delayed, they offer fasttrack service or refund.
XRP co founder Jed McCaleb continues to dump his XRP stack onto the market, has been doing for years. Currently averaging $375k per day.
This is pretty important: https://news.bitcoin.com/triple-entry-bookkeeping-how-satoshi-nakamoto-solved-the-byzantine-generals-problem/ read it.

DISCORD LINK: https://discord.gg/zxXXyuJ 🍕 Bring some virtual pizza to share 🍕
Come have a chat, stimulate a discussion, ask a question or share some knowledge. We are all friendly crypto enthusiasts up for a chat, supportive and want to help each other with knowledge and investments!
Big thanks to our Telegram and My Crypto HQ for the constant news updates! The Gravychain Collective: https://t.me/gravychain My Crypto HQ: https://t.me/My_Crypto_HQ

Links

Important/Notable/Highlights:

Special Mentions:

Other:

Hello /BTC. My name is Jkid, (Long-term unemployed) Linux Systems Adminsitrator and IT professional, Twitch Streamer, political an socio-economic researcher and analyst, and more recently moderator of /lostgeneration. I've been struggling to support my unemployed parents for four years as a sole income provider, and ended up sacrificing my remaining 20s and social, economic, and life milestones and it finally came to a head a few days ago when I saw a article about elderly couple who tried seeking help for month ended up deciding to end it. It brought up so much emotions because despite all my best efforts to help my own parents this may happen to them eventually, forced to live in the street or worse.
However, someone named oshisat who was a long-time /lostgeneration user invited me to try out a decentralized fundraiser system called bitfund.cash, a decentralized Bitcoin Cash Fundraising project created by akari_bit Basically it allows anyone to raise funds via Bitcoin Cash, without the need to log into an account. The process for me took an hour, but I already have a account with github. With trial and error and prior knowledge of basic html coming back to me from my Linux SysAdmin years I was able to set up the page.
Already I can see the advantages of Bitcoin, particularly Bitcoin Cash. Primarily it brings the potential of bringing cash to a portions of society that can't use banks particularly lower working class people.
And anyone with a cell phone, computer, and with a few basic safety precautions can use Bitcoin cash. A person can send money via Bitcoin cash address and the person holding the actual wallet can receive the money almost instantly, and with ATMs available in a growing amount of major cites, anyone can withdraw money without ATM fees.
As a left libertarian I want to support this however I can. That's why I want to post this fundraiser to help me and my family from being in the streets and for me getting a fresh start in life.
My fundraiser is located at https://ndokeh.github.io/helpJkid/
Already I've set up these initial goals to this end. These are in US Dollar equvilents as Bitcoin Cash amounts change by the minute or by the day. The '+' means the amount raised reaches another dollar amount above the initial $20 goal. I will add these goals within 24 hours onto my github page as they are fulfilled or not.
~~$20: ID renewal, as you need a ID to get anything done and mine's has expired last month.~~ GOAL MET!
~~$120+: Passport Renewal. My US Passport was expired two years ago, and I did not realize it until I found it in their basement of stuff at my relatives.~~GOAL MET!
$150+: I will start work on a personal webpage hosted by github. Initially basic but will include my writings, my resume, my photography and videography portfolio from my time at the University of Maryland to Anime conventions and street photography and political events and vigils, technology manuals and tutorials. Basically everything I know.
NEXT GOAL:$200+ (Up to $1200+ for a year): Allows me to rent a storage room from Uhaul to move all of my stuff that has been in my relatives basement for 8 years. Many of my stuff are of sentimental value to me because it represents the life that I wanted to have before my parents lost their jobs in 2014. Books, manga, video games, costumes, posters, video game consoles, electronics, clothes, comics. They're telling me that they want to fix the basement ASAP. In the event I can only rent a small room in a house or an apartment, I would not worry about my stuff being thrown away.
Certifications: A+ $250+ Linux+: $450+ Cloud+: $350+
With everyone having a Bachelors degree, the only way to stand out from the crowd is to have a IT certification. I had plans to get certifications after I moved out from my parents until it got derailed. The price include the cost of taking the exam and the book that allows the person to study for it. The Linux exam costs over 400 dollars because there are two exams that you have to take to get the Linux+ certification.
$300+: Pay off Best buy credit card, that I have been paying the minimum off for YEARS and it never went down.
$1000+ (up to $12000 for a year): Allows me to rent a room and pay ultities in the DC, MD, and VA area. If I can get a small room of my own, it will allow me to study, work on small jobs, play video games to stream publicly.
$1500+: I will be able to pay off my Perkins loan completely. I had plans to pay off my Perkins loan within 6 months of moving out of my parents. Now it had gotten close to becoming defaulted.
$2000+ (up to $12000 for 6 months): Allows my parents to stay in the house while they find people to rent out rooms without fear of being homeless or have power, gas, or water cut off.
$2100+: Allows me to use professional movers to move my stuff from my parents and relatives to my new home.
$2500+ (up to $30,000 for a whole year): Allows me to rent a one bedroom apartment and pay ultilites and cable/internet.
$3,000+ (up to 15,000): Will allow me to pay off one credit card that I'm totally behind in since I was laid off on October 2017.
$4,000+: Will allow me to pay the past due rent on the apartment we were forced to move out of because we could not afford it, despite paying the rent on time and giving proper notice.
$5,000+: Will allow me to set up a Gaming/Tech Studio with all the works: Including three Ultrawidescreen PC monitors, a Streaming PC, a Gaming/General Use PC, and a Linux Server for Podcast Production/Video Gaming Streaming/Movie production, plus a stream deck. Along with a comfortable chair due to my scorliosis.
$20,000+ I will start doing a weekly political and socio-economic commentary/research/analysis writing series: At least one commentary per week, with at least one of them related to bitcoin bitcoin cash and real economy (read, on the street) developments.
$25,000+ This will allow me to pay off my entire Federal Direct Student Loan that has been lingering for years since graduation.
$15,000+ I will start doing photography and videotography projects and allows me to travel the united states to this end and also allows me to attend and document anime/fan conventions. $15,000+ I will begin streaming sessions on twitch.tv, and fan commentary and analysis of anime, manga, video games, and otaku culture under the brand name "The Ministry of Otaku"
$15,000+ I will be able to write a non-fiction book in politics or in any other subject. Probably one about the media, internet culture, or socio-economics.
$15,000+ Allows me to travel to any one country in the world for a much needed vacation away from the slow decent of craziness and politically polarization of America: Canada, Taiwan, Britian, Japan, South Korea, Germany, Hong Kong.
One more thing: 3% of the proceeds in Bitcoin Cash in this fundraiser, will be used in some kind of way to support the movement.
If you have any doubts of my need, I will send you a folder or evidence of my proof of need ,including a letter of reference, via PM.
Thanks for your appreciation in advance. --Jkid

I have been wondering how these Bitcoin ATM Operators are getting away with setting buy/sell limits this high, especially the no verification limits?
Example; https://coinatmradar.com/bitcoin_atm/6765/bitcoin-atm-general-bytes-amsterdam-esm-phone-house/ located within the EU - has a 3000 EUR limit for no verification (and you can simply use it multiple times)
How can a machine like that be in compliance with measures from Directive (EU) 2015/847 & Directive (EU) 2015/849? (847 clearly mentiones 1000 EUR without being linked as the maximum value to be transfered for a transaction) I am not a laywer, but hopefully somebody here can explain to me how this is 'legal'/'allowed' :)

Hello, and welcome to IOTA. *insert futuristic music here

You're probably here because you just received a tip. Congratulations. You must have done something wonderful. The tip you've received is a special type of crypto currency called 'IOTA.' IOTA was first created in 2015 when our founders realized that to really bring crypto to the masses (human and machine!) you need a way to safely send someone value or data without paying a fee, because even small fees can add up, and that fails to mimic real currency.

Enter IOTA.

The tip you received lives on reddit servers and is indexed and generated automatically using your username. You can withdraw this tip at anytime to your own private wallet. For a complete guide to the tipbot you can click here. Otherwise, let's continue.

If you'd like to tip someone on reddit. Format your tip inside of a comment like this:

+1000 iota iotatipbot

An 'Iota' is the lowest unit. If you really want to spend big you can give 1 million iota's (aka 'mega' iota) like this:

+1 miota iotatipbot

The tipbot will also reference the dollar value of your tip.

When you properly tip someone or receive a tip yourself you are given a list of links (these links can also be referenced on the sidebar of /iotatipbot). When you click those links it messages the bot to do that action. Just refresh your browser and then check your messages!

Ok let's cut to the chase. You're probably wondering. "How much money do I have!?"

Currently,
**1 miota is worth
~~$.55~~
~~$1.10~~
$3.85
if someone tipped you 10 miota you now have in your possession
~~$5.55~~
~~$11~~
$38.50
worth of IOTA. Play around with different amounts of IOTA and there values here. Did someone tip you 100 or a 1000 'iota'? Sorry, you have less that 1 penny.

So, there's a lot you can do with this new found wealth.

1.You can leave it in the bot and tip other users. If you tip less then $.01 in value the bot will send them the tip privately so out of courtesy we don't spam message threads.

2.You can withdraw your iota. This will require you to install a mobile/web/or desktop wallet. Since IOTA uses a different system then bitcoin the wallet will be a little different then a BTC wallet. Follow instructions carefully.

3.You can deposit to your reddit username wallet using the 'deposit' link. This is a little more complicated, especially if you don't own any crypto. You'll need to buy some ETH or BTC on an exchange with a bank transfer then send the ETH or BTC to one of our two participating exchanges Bitfinex and Binance. Hopefully in the near future we will have more ways to buy IOTA!

A few of you might be thinking:

"HEY BUDDY. I don't want to deal with any of this crap! I just want some cold hard cash!"

Ok, got it, no need to yell! Let's say someone tipped you a good amount and you want cash as quickly as possible. The best way to do that at this time is to open a Binance account, withdraw your IOTA directly to it, sell it for BTC, send the BTC to a mobile wallet and locate a BTC ATM near you. Finally, sell your BTC for cash at that ATM. You can also find real people to sell BTC to at meetups and localbitcoins.com. No ATM? Some exchanges allow bank transfers but this may be slower.

In the future we hope to have an Android/IOS wallet that you can convert your IOTA on the fly to BTC while you're driving to an ATM! Although, you might want to think twice about selling your IOTA, it may grow in value exponentially! Track it here.

Hope all this helped! If you're looking for more detailed help on how to set up a wallet, how to use exchanges, blockchain vs DAG, total supply, market cap, machines using IOTA (m2m) or the complete vision of IOTA. Check out the sidebar and stickied links on /iota.

Once again WELCOME!

edit 1: removed 'glorious'

edit 2: Bot is now private below $.01 value threshold.

edit 3: We also have a second tip bot functioning called 'tanglepayTipBot'
discussion thread
wiki
tip like this
tanglepay +$.05

Edit 4. Are you VERY new to crypto?

These three videos are helpful

L2 - The Innovation Is the Blockchain
L2 - A Primer on Crypto Currencies
Tangle vs Blockchain

I originally wrote this a month ago but decided not to post it. After being denied twice since, I have decided that I should post it.
Today my card was blocked in France while trying to top up credit on my phone. I was given three questions, answered each of them correctly (where i’ve lived in boulder, where my brother lives, how old my mom is) and yet I was still blocked. I was also told by my bank that there’s nothing they can do about this, it’s between visa and the merchant, so as long as I try to use visa I will always run into this problem. At any point my card can be blocked because they ask questions that cannot be answered correctly, or even when answered correctly it will still be blocked.
original post
Backstory: I lived in Thailand and had plans to go to a conference in Ho Chi Minh, Vietnam. Today I used my bank card to purchase one of the few things in life that I can’t with BTC, a visa for Vietnam. However, when going through processing I was asked three verification questions:

Who did you buy the house at xxx address from?

Not sure of the exact wording used, but it was basically how did you come to own/how did you buy/etc.. Unfortunately for me I’ve never seen that address in my life, i have no idea where it comes from as I’ve only ever lived at two residences in America, both of which I know the address to. There was option for this is not applicable to me which i chose.

What age range is closest for Mom Tackett

My mom’s last name isn’t tackett though, so I don’t know why they’re using that name. She and my dad have been divorced since before I can remember, so they’re using information that’s out of date since at least 1995. The age ranges they gave me didn’t actually have one with her age, it was something like 25-35, 40-45, 46-55, 60+, my mom is 56. There was no correct answer. I chose the closest and went from there.

What city does Brother Tackett live in?

My brother moved several months ago, so again, there was no correct answer. But it did have his previous city, so I answered with that.
After all of that they deemed that it was a fraudulent transaction and wouldn’t process it. Luckily for me, the fraud department at my bank was online and was able to remove the block and for me to book my visa. So you may say, “see! the system works." However, when I had this exact same problem in 2013 while in Thailand trying to buy a flight i lost out on hundreds of dollars because I had to go to an agent and pay with cash.
I had a conversation with some people in a bitcoin wechat group im in about how much I hate banks after taking my ICBC (largest bank in the world) card to an ICBC branch in malaysia to withdraw all my money since I can’t use the card in Thailand (even at an ICBC branch). Unfortunately in Malaysia I also can’t use that card, even at an ICBC. People were saying i’m doing myself a disservice by not having a bank, but in the past 8 days i’ve been denied my money from my bank three times, once in Thailand trying to use an ICBC, once in Malaysia trying to use an ICBC, and now by Visa. I’ve never once been prompted to go through verification with bitcoin, i’ve never once been denied the ability to send money, and for the people saying the verification/restrictions are for my safety, i’ve never had as much as a satoshi stolen from me, but i have had to spend hundreds of dollars to fix the mess caused by my banks.
This is why i’ve had my salary paid 100% in bitcoin for over 2 years, this is why I hold the vast majority of my money in bitcoin, and this is why I know that bitcoin has a future. To anybody who says that the current banking system works just fine, that’s ludicrous, start traveling and nearly every day you’ll see why bitcoin is needed; fees to convert currency, 5-50%—yes, it was literally 50% to convert Vietnamese dong to Thai baht at the Phuket airport; fees to withdraw from an ATM ($6, 2%); and tons of places charge you extra 3-5% plus flat fee if you use a cc.
Other stories about why I hate banks
Story time: In 2014 I was at Bitcoin2014 in Amsterdam, had an amazing trip that forever changed my life. While there I discovered that if you don’t have chip & pin a lot of places won’t accept your debit card, and even worse that they don’t even accept cash. My bank didn’t offer chip & pin cards when mine was issued so unfortunately couldn’t use my card nor my cash. When i went back to the states in July I asked specifically for a chip and pin card but they said they still don’t offer them and that I’d have to deal with swipe and sign for the time being. So I got my card and headed off on my travels once more, this time to kyrgyzstan and kazakhstan. When I get there I receive an email from my bank that they’ll promptly be canceling my card as they’re switching everyone over to chip and pin. I could ask for a two-week extension, but that’s it, after that I’ll have to wait for my new card to arrive. They also won’t send cards abroad, so i have to have it sent to my family and then have them ship it to asia (one card has already been lost in this process). So once again, I have no way to access my money.
Second Story time: When bitcoin hit $1000 in 2013 some friends and I took a trip to the Philippines. I sold a bitcoin and had the fiat transferred to my bank account (Wells Fargo). I went to use my card at an ATM and it was denied, I called my bank and tried to get the situation fixed. After going through social security number, recent withdrawal locations/amounts, and account information they said "no problem, we’ll have it all fixed here shortly, just need you to tell me how much your monthly mortgage payments are.” I was 21 and living in Beijing, i didn’t have any mortgage payments. So he let me know that wasn’t a problem, just needed to know how much my monthly car payment was. I was 21 and living in Beijing, I didn't have a monthly car payment. I was then promptly told “bummer, nothing we can do” and had to spend well over an hour going from supervisor to supervisor before I finally got the block lifted. It’s important to note that I notified them of my travel plans well in advance of my trip.
This is why I love bitcoin, my money is actually my money and i can use it 24/7/365. Even if I need to wait 30 minutes for a confirmation, it is vastly superior to not being to use your money at all.
Tldr; Visa has deemed my transactions fraudulent several times because i was unable to answer security questions that don't have correct answers. Bitcoin has never told me I can't spend my money.

If you don't want to read, watch AtheneLIVE VOD addressing this post. (From 39 minutes to ~57 minutes)
Yesterday i asked a question on stream about deleting the vods/list/records of people having purpose and the response was along the lines of tax evasion. Taxes are the least concern here. With that in mind i made a post that is directed towards everyone holding PPRS and DUBI.
Many people on /bitcoin (or any other cryptocurrency subreddit) do not tell the amount of crypto they have and discourage people saying it on non-anonymous accounts. Crypto millionaires or people looking for advice on huge BTC amounts use throw-away accounts.
There is a reason for that.
Let's say i see Nolen4Athene posting on /bitcoin bragging about his lambos he is gonna buy (ye boi), since he has a 1000 BTC (which is 10 360 000 dollars ATM). He becomes a potential target for anyone on the internet.
Now i start tracking his every comment and every social media account he has. I get try to get his personal information (mostly addresses). While at it i figured out he made a wallet which requires a 12 word seed. That means i can get hold of his Bitcoins.
Long story short, if i know where he lives and i can either try and break into his house, try and get a keylogger on him (hacking) or if i am a friend his family knows, i might get into his house really easily.
You might think this is paranoid, but look at how everything turns out:

I can get his 12 word seed without anyone seeing i stole it because most of us are probably average Joes living in an apartment, without any security. It is not difficult. (be careful about people applying and coming over too).
Getting the BTC to USD anonymously is easy by using Monero and a Decentralized exchange (i don't need my ID for this). If you want to take a step further you can use crypto gambling sites and wash your money there. Good luck finding out who did this.
10 MILLION DOLLARS For this amount of work is nothing compared to what people do for less. People could dirty their hands once if they knew they could retire. (Athene mentioned this himself to be careful with friends and money. Do not make situation where trust is the only link between you and your money).

Now puzzle everything in how easy it is to do this. You aren't robing a bank here, but the amount of money you are getting is close to that.
Find target with BTC -> Find out storing method -> Find target address -> Find home -> Sneak in and find word seed -> The rest is history.
Even if nobody is going to barge into your house, you will definitely have hackers tracking you and trying to get your funds. Getting your PC infected with a keylogger would be their main priority.
It's a joke to criminals. You still might say that this is paranoid thinking, but this is 10 million dollars and there are people in this world that kill each other because of greed. In Venezuela's crisis people are (were hopefully) starving, had to wait in line to get food for them and their family and they were at risk at getting stabbed for it. This guy from Venezuela told that he had to conceal his identity, because if someone knew he had Bitcoins he would get harmed or killed for it. (these might be extreme examples, but they apply to less-developed countries. If you are in a more developed country you are obviously more secure)
If what Athene says is true (and based on his huge track record), then PRPS and DUBI worth can be more than that. There are many people who have more than 10 000 PRPS, which might turn to be a few million USD.
What we are doing here isn't really anonymous and the stream mentions how much PRPS people have, which creates a huge possibility of them getting targeted. Right now nobody knows about PRPS and DUBI, but when it blows up there will be a lot of people interested, because we are talking money. READ MORE and MORE
As an example i know a person (i can't say his name) who got shoutcalled who has a few thousand purpose. His twitch name is the same as his twitter name and i can see his addresses and his location where he jogs. To make things even easier he streams so i already know his face which i can get personal information about him by asking questions ("are you leaving home any time soon")
Social engineering hacking isn't new and there are many stories of bitcoins getting hacked like that in google search.
There are complaints from husbands who have their wives asking them how much Bitcoin they have and sometimes even asking for their private keys. Google that too or read a reddit post here
The vods go back to the start of 2016, which is over 2 years ago. After only a year PRPS will blow up already and it isn't hard for people to watch the vods and look for people who are rich on PRPS.
If you reaction is this is insane, yes it is crazy and probably hard to believe, but compared to what people do to obtain money, this is nothing. Being aware of this is important for everyone.
I am not telling anyone what to do, but i want everyone to be aware of history that has happened already and we need to know history to not repeat it again. I want this community to stay safe because we are all very special people. We help the world and we need more like-minded people like this. Maybe we don't influence the masses as much because we have to spend time making sure our families are all healthy, well and financially stable. PRPS and DUBI is what will allow us to spend time helping others around us. In the future we will be able to create our own Pineapple fund and by the voice of our community help the more effective charities and this help the people in need. I want everyone to be part of this movement.
Just like these guys in Venezuela's financial crisis
"Becoming rich is the easy part, staying rich is the hard part"
TL;DR: YOUR FUNDS NEED SECURITY FROM BOTH DIGITAL AND PHYSICAL THREATS. PRIVACY IS WHAT HELPS YOU STAY ANONYMOUS AND AVOIDS GETTING TARGETED BY PEOPLE WHO WANT TO STEAL/HARM YOU. THIS IS NOT A POSSIBILITY BUT A REALITY WE HAVE TO UNDERSTAND AND DEAL WITH
DO NOT TELL PEOPLE HOW MUCH PRPS OR DUBI YOU HAVE, NOT YOUR FRIEND, NOT YOUR WIFE, NOT YOUR DOG OR ELSE YOU ARE GIVING AWAY INFORMATION ABOUT YOUR EASILY ACCESSIBLE FUNDS. NO BANK OR GOVERNMENT CAN HELP YOU IN THIS SITUATION IF YOU LOSE YOUR FUNDS
BE AWARE OF YOUR TWITCH USERNAME BEING THE SAME TO ANY OF YOUR SOCIAL MEDIA ACCOUNTS
Edit: Some advice for people get that win from lotteries and crypto - when you hoard a lot of money or cash out, don't use that money for a month, because you will have an "adrenaline rush" to want to spend money. By letting that money stay there you get used to it and won't be emotional.

Before I go into my story let me introduce myself.
I work in the financial services sector, live in New York and am new to Bitcoin. Recently, I’ve decided to give a try and buy some bitcoins. Everyone talks bitcoin so I wanted to evaluate the future of the currency for myself.
First, I googled the most popular ways to buy bitcoins. Decided to start with the exchange.
After reading numerous stories about Mt. Gox, bitstamp and other exchanges decided to register with Coinbase for the reasons you all probably know. The basic registration process was straightforward and simple. However, in order to buy bitcoins you have to go through verification procedure. You need to link your bank account to Coinbase, provide your billing address and in case if you want to make buying bitcoins instant you also need to link your credit card. So you provide the same information you need to provide to any US bank to be able to buy bitcoins. There is no anonymity or privacy. It’s a myth. Then you buy bitcoins. You would expect instant transaction but instead you have to wait 4-5 days for the transaction to complete. So if I need to buy something with bitcoins the same day – I can’t. Moreover, the worst part is that while you are waiting for the transaction to complete the price of bitcoin fluctuates. In my case, it fell 15 USD which was more or less equal to 10% of the price of btc on the day of purchase. So btc lost 10% value against USD while I was waiting for the transaction to complete. In addition, you also have limits. You cannot buy more than 1000 USD worth of btc in one week. I thought this was totally ridiculous. What was the reason for going through all these verification steps if you are still facing limits? However, as I am new to btc decided to give another try.
This time I registered with Coinbase Exchange. Again, you have to provide your SSN and link with coinbase account. When you register with the exchange Coinbase opens so-called “USD Wallet”. You can now transfer USD to this wallet and then instantly transfer them to btc or trade in the Exchange. However, the transfer again takes 4/5 days.
I was totally disappointed by how the whole system works. I thought bitcoin users were treated like some kind of criminals. I wasn’t simply asked to verify my identity by providing all the usual KYC information, but I also faced buy/sell limits (1000 USD a week), 4/5 delays in transaction completion. Moreover, I had to provide all my bank details to Coinbase. I felt like I had no other choice as to trust Coinbase despite the fact that they disclose very little information about security measures they implement to store my personal information. Moreover, Coinbase was not different from any bank around the corner with its KYC procedures.
Anyway, I thought it was too early to give up. Decided to try localbitcoins. Unfortunately, I experienced another disappointment. Bitcoins are sold in average with 6-7% premium. And you have to pay this premium every single time you buy btc. You also have limited options for buying btc: Moneygram/WU transfers, national bank transfers, paypal transfers and gift codes. From all these options the only instant and acceptable option was paypal. However, the seller of btc requested my photo holding some ID for verification process. Here you are not dealing with Coinbase, which is supported by NYSE, but with some ordinary guy who God knows how treats and secures the information you provide to him. I understand the reasons why he/she asks for the verification but still find it irresponsible to trust this person. I have no idea who he/she is and how he/she handles the information I provide (in case of buying using paypal).
Of course you can also buy with cash. I tried that option as well. Buying with cash involves arranging a meeting with some stranger somewhere in your town. So you have to arrange the time and place to meet and both of you should agree on this. Then you have to carry cash with you, which is another risk. And of course you wont carry over 1000 USD especially if this is your first transaction with some stranger. Finally, again you have to pay around 10% premium.
Then I found out about guys from LibertyX. I read some of their interviews and thought they were trustworthy. They claimed that one could buy their so-called Qpins in big stores nationwide and redeem them for btc. However, when I visited their website it turned out that I had some outdated information. In reality it’s possible to buy Qpins only from small stores in Manhattan and Brooklyn. They recommend calling the stores before visiting them. I followed their advice, but not a single store in Manhattan answered my call. So I decided to try my luck and go there without speaking to them on the phone. One store was out of business. Another one claimed that it didn’t sell bitcoins. In such case LibertyX recommends calling them, as they know how to handle such situations. So right from the store I called LibertyX. Guess what? All their operators (probably 1 or 2 people) were busy to answer my call. So decided to go to Brooklyn. And again one store was closed and the other store manager didn’t know what I was talking about. However, after 30 minutes of explanation the store manager finally figured out how to find in their system Qpins and sell them to me. Overall, the whole process took 1.5 hours. I came home, logged in to LibertyX website to redeem the pins and receive btc. They also collect personal information. I entered my real name and address. Their system gave an error message saying that it couldn’t verify the information I provided and asked me to send verification information (scan of ID). In order not to lose my money, I had to provide them the scan of my ID. Then I had to wait a day for my account to get verified. Please, note that they also have 1500 USD weekly limit.
I am a stubborn guy and I hate banks enough to give another chance for bitcoin to prove itself as future currency and therefore I decided to try bitcoin ATMs instead of all methods described above. I visited coinatmradar.com to locate the nearest ATM. I found three ATMs in Manhattan and two in Brooklyn. Visited all of them and didn’t find any ATM in any of these locations.
Finally, decided to try to register with the European exchange to compare with the US one. I couldn’t even register with them because Europeans avoid providing financial services to the US citizens. My attempt failed. The same happened when I tried to buy bitcoins through VirWox.com.
So here are my conclusions.

Buying bitcoins is not anonymous.
Unless you use cold storage/offline solution you do not hold bitcoins but some institution like Coinbase does.
Buying bitcoins is not a straightforward process, is time consuming and requires risk acceptance.
Buying bitcoins is expensive. You will normally pay 10% premium when buying for cash or paypal. This premium equals to a dream annual return of most hedge funds (and their investors accordingly).
You have to verify your identity when buying btc through exchanges or companies like LibertyX. You go through the same procedure as when opening a bank account.
There isn’t any operating ATM in New York. This is due to “bitlicense” uncertainty. However, even if bitlicense is implemented not a single ATM would operate profitably under money transmitter licensing.
You face limits when buying bitcoins. Coinbase and Circle have 1000 USD weekly limits. LibertyX has 1500 USD limit. Localbitcoins doesn’t have limits but you cannot buy btc using debit/credit card. Moreover, when buying through localbitcoins you have to be aware of scammers.
The high cost of buying btc can potentially offset the benefits of low transaction costs. It might be cheaper to use your debit card.

Therefore I don’t see a single benefit of dealing with bitcoin instead of fiat (i.e. banks) in current environment. There is no “killer app” requiring you to go through all the above procedures to buy bitcoin. I think the only people who are willing to go through all this hell in order to buy btc are the ones who use them illegally in the dark market, some enthusiasts/revolutionists/anarchists who believe in the long run success of btc, hate banks and current financial system; and people who either trade btc or use it occasionally for some purchases online. I don’t see how mass adoption can happen if you cannot buy bitcoins with two-three clicks online. I don’t understand who would wait 4/5 days to get btc when the price fluctuates every 10 minutes.
What I do now is I buy btc using Coinbase. Then I send them to bitreserve.org and hold them in different currencies. However, even if I want and need to buy btc instantly I simply cannot do this. If instant buying is possible then I have to pay high premium. I find it much cheaper to use my debit card and pay bank fees, which are nothing in comparison with the premium to buy btc.
Please, prove me wrong or enlighten me. Maybe I am missing something.

I originally wrote this a month ago but decided not to post it. After being denied twice since, I have decided that I should post it.
Today my card was blocked in France while trying to top up credit on my phone. I was given three questions, answered each of them correctly (where i’ve lived in boulder, where my brother lives, how old my mom is) and yet I was still blocked. I was also told by my bank that there’s nothing they can do about this, it’s between visa and the merchant, so as long as I try to use visa I will always run into this problem. At any point my card can be blocked because they ask questions that cannot be answered correctly, or even when answered correctly it will still be blocked.
original post
Backstory: I lived in Thailand and had plans to go to a conference in Ho Chi Minh, Vietnam. Today I used my bank card to purchase one of the few things in life that I can’t with BTC, a visa for Vietnam. However, when going through processing I was asked three verification questions:

Who did you buy the house at xxx address from?

Not sure of the exact wording used, but it was basically how did you come to own/how did you buy/etc.. Unfortunately for me I’ve never seen that address in my life, i have no idea where it comes from as I’ve only ever lived at two residences in America, both of which I know the address to. There was option for this is not applicable to me which i chose.

What age range is closest for Mom Tackett

My mom’s last name isn’t tackett though, so I don’t know why they’re using that name. She and my dad have been divorced since before I can remember, so they’re using information that’s out of date since at least 1995. The age ranges they gave me didn’t actually have one with her age, it was something like 25-35, 40-45, 46-55, 60+, my mom is 56. There was no correct answer. I chose the closest and went from there.

What city does Brother Tackett live in?

My brother moved several months ago, so again, there was no correct answer. But it did have his previous city, so I answered with that.
After all of that they deemed that it was a fraudulent transaction and wouldn’t process it. Luckily for me, the fraud department at my bank was online and was able to remove the block and for me to book my visa. So you may say, “see! the system works." However, when I had this exact same problem in 2013 while in Thailand trying to buy a flight i lost out on hundreds of dollars because I had to go to an agent and pay with cash.
I had a conversation with some people in a bitcoin wechat group im in about how much I hate banks after taking my ICBC (largest bank in the world) card to an ICBC branch in malaysia to withdraw all my money since I can’t use the card in Thailand (even at an ICBC branch). Unfortunately in Malaysia I also can’t use that card, even at an ICBC. People were saying i’m doing myself a disservice by not having a bank, but in the past 8 days i’ve been denied my money from my bank three times, once in Thailand trying to use an ICBC, once in Malaysia trying to use an ICBC, and now by Visa. I’ve never once been prompted to go through verification with bitcoin, i’ve never once been denied the ability to send money, and for the people saying the verification/restrictions are for my safety, i’ve never had as much as a satoshi stolen from me, but i have had to spend hundreds of dollars to fix the mess caused by my banks.
This is why i’ve had my salary paid 100% in bitcoin for over 2 years, this is why I hold the vast majority of my money in bitcoin, and this is why I know that bitcoin has a future. To anybody who says that the current banking system works just fine, that’s ludicrous, start traveling and nearly every day you’ll see why bitcoin is needed; fees to convert currency, 5-50%—yes, it was literally 50% to convert Vietnamese dong to Thai baht at the Phuket airport; fees to withdraw from an ATM ($6, 2%); and tons of places charge you extra 3-5% plus flat fee if you use a cc.
Other stories about why I hate banks
Story time: In 2014 I was at Bitcoin2014 in Amsterdam, had an amazing trip that forever changed my life. While there I discovered that if you don’t have chip & pin a lot of places won’t accept your debit card, and even worse that they don’t even accept cash. My bank didn’t offer chip & pin cards when mine was issued so unfortunately couldn’t use my card nor my cash. When i went back to the states in July I asked specifically for a chip and pin card but they said they still don’t offer them and that I’d have to deal with swipe and sign for the time being. So I got my card and headed off on my travels once more, this time to kyrgyzstan and kazakhstan. When I get there I receive an email from my bank that they’ll promptly be canceling my card as they’re switching everyone over to chip and pin. I could ask for a two-week extension, but that’s it, after that I’ll have to wait for my new card to arrive. They also won’t send cards abroad, so i have to have it sent to my family and then have them ship it to asia (one card has already been lost in this process). So once again, I have no way to access my money.
Second Story time: When bitcoin hit $1000 in 2013 some friends and I took a trip to the Philippines. I sold a bitcoin and had the fiat transferred to my bank account (Wells Fargo). I went to use my card at an ATM and it was denied, I called my bank and tried to get the situation fixed. After going through social security number, recent withdrawal locations/amounts, and account information they said "no problem, we’ll have it all fixed here shortly, just need you to tell me how much your monthly mortgage payments are.” I was 21 and living in Beijing, i didn’t have any mortgage payments. So he let me know that wasn’t a problem, just needed to know how much my monthly car payment was. I was 21 and living in Beijing, I didn't have a monthly car payment. I was then promptly told “bummer, nothing we can do” and had to spend well over an hour going from supervisor to supervisor before I finally got the block lifted. It’s important to note that I notified them of my travel plans well in advance of my trip.
This is why I love bitcoin, my money is actually my money and i can use it 24/7/365. Even if I need to wait 30 minutes for a confirmation, it is vastly superior to not being to use your money at all.
Tldr; Visa has deemed my transactions fraudulent several times because i was unable to answer security questions that don't have correct answers. Bitcoin has never told me I can't spend my money.

Period: 397.81 days

	Submissions	Comments
Total	1000	56541
Rate (per day)	2.51	142.01
Unique Redditors	464	7342
Combined Score	206440	328741

Top Submitters' Top Submissions

22577 points, 69 submissions: noah_vechain
6682 points, 40 submissions: skythe4
5656 points, 20 submissions: GreatWhiteSharkCIA
4532 points, 23 submissions: CryptopherWalken
1. The cryptocurrency ban is over. Please be mature, responsible and judicious. (584 points, 53 comments)
2. NYC Meetup - Full Summary! (445 points, 69 comments)
3. BYD tweets at Vitalik, quotes him, and points to VeChain as " the real world application for blockchain we've all been waiting for." (359 points, 127 comments)
4. NYC Meetup Update (248 points, 154 comments)
5. Phil Hellmuth on Twitter: "Flying into Vegas for the day to chill w VEN (VEChain) CEO and Founder @SunshineLu24 and DBet CEO and Founder @JedidiahTaylor, flying out at 9:30 PM" (231 points, 74 comments)
6. Crypto_Ed_NL on Twitter: "I have a good feeling about a new prediction..... If $VEN gets all done what they are planning, I expect them to surpass ETH within a year from now." (215 points, 199 comments)
7. VeChain Mentioned in November issue of Motortrend magazine! (200 points, 19 comments)
8. Sunny Lu re Drug and Vaccine Solution: “Bigger than you think” (184 points, 61 comments)
9. Kevin Feng: "GDPR is apparently the hottest topic among our EU clients and government departments. In the past 12 months, VeChain has been working closely with professional service firms to assess and enhance our solutions and internal controls to comply with global regulations." (177 points, 9 comments)
10. Sarah, VeChain Singapore Manager: "T- 1 day! Extremely excited @vechainofficial is one of 30 startups selected for the LVMH innovation award #GoVeChain #VeChainThor #LVMHTech #FutureofLuxury #Blockchain #VivaTech" (167 points, 51 comments)
3000 points, 17 submissions: Stockton_Slap209
1. Rebrand Date IMPORTANT (365 points, 123 comments)
2. Yicai Global retweets PBoC Rumor (310 points, 202 comments)
3. Holy Sh%&t. Have you guys seen who are CTO is? (257 points, 70 comments)
4. VeChain mentioned on Today! Bullish! (238 points, 27 comments)
5. 1,000,000 clauses on VeChainThor mainnet! Milestone reached! (210 points, 103 comments)
6. The entire milk section of this convenience store (and every other of this brand) is Bright Foods (光明) Do not underestimate the size of this partnership $VET $VTHO (194 points, 16 comments)
7. VeChain Partners With Xiamen Innov Information Technology Co. LTD (Innov) (183 points, 41 comments)
8. Hello. I am the VeChain Tipbot. (24h public testnet beta) (152 points, 34 comments)
9. Sneak peak at the Blockchain in Action.... THOR (145 points, 30 comments)
10. Check out this SBTG video! Spread it like wildfire and show the true power of the VeChain community!! (132 points, 27 comments)
2877 points, 12 submissions: B5SF
1. VeChain Twitter: It's a great honor to meet Alexander De Croo, Deputy Prime Minister of Belgium [...] (503 points, 101 comments)
2. DNV GL partners with blockchain expert VeChain to increase transparency from the factory to the consumer (462 points, 109 comments)
3. Introducing VeChain’s CTO Gu Jianliang to the Community (394 points, 61 comments)
4. BYD Auto - Gobal Developers Conference (Sep 5th) - VeChain's CEO Sunny Lu attending (271 points, 92 comments)
5. Cyprus to collaborate with VeChain Foundation and CREAM for fintech, blockchain development in Cyprus (247 points, 76 comments)
6. The Coca Cola Kid on Twitter - "Is it time?" (213 points, 102 comments)
7. VeChain Partners with Shanghai Gas and ENN to Pilot Blockchain-Enabled Liquified Natural Gas Solution (202 points, 7 comments)
8. China orders banks to stop financing cryptocurrencies & plans his own digital currency (140 points, 225 comments)
9. At 8:00 on January 4, 2018, the founder of Vechain, Lu Yang, will make a breakthrough in technological transformation at the live-streaming "China-US Blockchain Broadcasting Group" (138 points, 70 comments)
10. Sunny Lu: Ladies and gentlemen, welcome onboard to VeChain Airline. Please fasten your seat belt and we are about to take off soon. (125 points, 59 comments)
2645 points, 19 submissions: Roc_Raida
1. WATCH NOW: Advancements with Ted Danson (CNBC) Blockchain with VeChain (324 points, 62 comments)
2. VeChain's Tech Deep Dive Series - Session 1, Episode 4: Introduction to Sensor and Smart Chips (189 points, 16 comments)
3. Check Your VeChainThor Wallets ;) (187 points, 107 comments)
4. You Can Now See Your New VET Balance on Binance ! (165 points, 146 comments)
5. BMW Startup Garage Retweets Jerome Speaking at BMW Group IT Tech Demo Day (160 points, 17 comments)
6. SPOTTED: OceanEX & VeChain Sign (149 points, 43 comments)
7. Morpheus Labs onboards a renowned Blockchain — VeChain (135 points, 21 comments)
8. Invest Cyprus Tweets the signing of an MoU with VeChain and CREAM (133 points, 22 comments)
9. Cycling for carbon credits - Remi Eriksen (DNV GL Group President and CEO) (132 points, 18 comments)
10. PLAIR (PLA) Now Featured in VeChainThor Wallet ! (120 points, 63 comments)
2550 points, 16 submissions: born2net4
1. Circle-X and VeChain's Blockchain-X... (290 points, 99 comments)
2. VeChainThor Wallet User Manual & X Node Binding & Token Swap Guide (287 points, 88 comments)
3. Chinese President Xi Jinping calls blockchain a 'breakthrough' technology (238 points, 15 comments)
4. Ethereum Billionaire Looks to China for Next Big Crypto Winners (VeChain baby) (210 points, 32 comments)
5. Pharma Giant Merck Eyes Blockchain for Fighting Counterfeit Meds (201 points, 42 comments)
6. Your take on Sunny's live stream... (167 points, 163 comments)
7. Hardest working guy in Crypto, Sunny Lu! (138 points, 17 comments)
8. BoxMining meets Sunny Lu (128 points, 4 comments)
9. VeChainThor connection to testnet video tutorial (my first video on VeChain dev) (123 points, 11 comments)
10. To Da Moon, check it out..... cool stuff!!!! (117 points, 22 comments)
2243 points, 11 submissions: Deaf_null
1. Binance needs to lower VEN transaction fees, let’s act as a community. What can we do? (384 points, 52 comments)
2. Vechain ready to rock crypto-market with rebrand (325 points, 53 comments)
3. 3 Reasons why to buy Vechain in 2018 (246 points, 41 comments)
4. Vechain has a bright future ahead. (237 points, 53 comments)
5. VeChain, QTUM, HPB and Metaverse partner with CPChain to revolutionise IoT in China (188 points, 36 comments)
6. Vechain Bullrun vid. (174 points, 41 comments)
7. Best alternatives to Bitcoin? Vechain #4 (165 points, 24 comments)
8. BREYER Bullish on VEN (149 points, 4 comments)
9. Vechain’s Blockchain-as-a-service seeks to stop product counterfeiters (130 points, 7 comments)
10. CHINESE OFFICIAL: NEW REGULATIONS FOR 2018 MAY END ICO BAN? (124 points, 26 comments)
2240 points, 8 submissions: patek_
1. We are Trending on the Frontpage - Dont forget to upvote! VeChain’s Latest Partnership (565 points, 29 comments)
2. Chinese Goverment Bullish News on Crypto - Expect a Boost for China Coins (356 points, 67 comments)
3. Why I believe Vechain could reach $100 in 2018. (308 points, 247 comments)
4. Breyer Capital and Vechain (291 points, 44 comments)
5. Reminder: Jim Breyer VeChain Advisor (264 points, 45 comments)
6. VeChain Thor Positioning To Become The #1 Enterprise dApp Platform, And Here’s Why - A Systems Analyst’s Perspective (172 points, 4 comments)
7. “VeChain - The Future of Blockchain in China” (155 points, 29 comments)
8. VeChain Rebranding Coming Soon! (129 points, 35 comments)

Top Commenters

lol_and_behold (3848 points, 442 comments)
ohredditplease (3525 points, 524 comments)
Lurks_no_longer (3085 points, 189 comments)
hungryforitalianfood (2821 points, 501 comments)
waylandsphere (2585 points, 884 comments)
SolomonGrundle (2582 points, 339 comments)
Camsy34 (2556 points, 229 comments)
born2net4 (2045 points, 168 comments)
Crypto-knowdeway (1979 points, 164 comments)
Bacon_Hero (1966 points, 293 comments)

Top Submissions

VeChain will partner with Fanghuwang, one of the fastest growing online lending platforms in China with $3.3bn AUM. With this partnership, VeChain Thor solves major problems within one of the largest global industries. by deleted (1352 points, 278 comments)
VeChain announced working with BMW by suf0x (1292 points, 295 comments)
VeChain passes the first ever Cryptocurrency Disaster Recovery Plan from PwC by noah_vechain (1142 points, 124 comments)
Sunny Lu came into the VeChain telegram chat to address the FUD rumours about the tokenomics (in-house suppression, dumping, etc.) by deleted (1086 points, 182 comments)
VeChain mods removed a legitimate criticism to VeChain. It cant always be happy rainbows and sunshine. We need to hear and discuss all the sides. Here is the text that was removed by them. by CoinStarX (1076 points, 126 comments)
Vechain Partners with Tobacco by Castomere (994 points, 272 comments)
VeChain Signs A Partnership Agreement With Yida Group’s IT Management division, Yida Future by noah_vechain (849 points, 174 comments)
At exactly 08:00:09 the first block was successfully mined. The VeChainThor Blockchain has officially launched by Yes-Lawd (799 points, 324 comments)
VeChain partners with Australian based 188 Business Alliance Association by noah_vechain (787 points, 117 comments)
VeChain introduces VeResearch, a global innovation research grant program formed by research professionals to integrate blockchain into new and emerging technologies by Moussa93 (781 points, 143 comments)

Top Comments

355 points: Criptolete's comment in Just visited VeChain offices in Shanghai: got my hoodie and nice info for you!
299 points: Crypto078's comment in A message from Sunny Lu: STOP ASKING VECHAIN PARTNERS FOR MORE INFO
275 points: deleted's comment in VeChain mods removed a legitimate criticism to VeChain. It cant always be happy rainbows and sunshine. We need to hear and discuss all the sides. Here is the text that was removed by them.
255 points: eimajine1's comment in VET in september ;-)
249 points: Lurks_no_longer's comment in cryptocurrency mods have banned Vechain posts for a month
232 points: KMcCaig's comment in Sunny Lu came into the VeChain telegram chat to address the FUD rumours about the tokenomics (in-house suppression, dumping, etc.)
229 points: dotbomb_jeff's comment in VECHAIN can't say this, so I will...(X Node RANT)
223 points: deleted's comment in New Coca Cola Kid post
211 points: icculus2001's comment in What are your concerns?
199 points: catdeuce's comment in There's only one survivor of this year's cryptocurrency slaughter: VeChain

Generated with BBoe's Subreddit Stats

Preamble
The purpose of this post is not to discourage enthusiasm over the recent appreciation of Bitcoin. Everyone here is excited, and rightly so. I’ve put this together because I think people are getting a bit caught up in price mania and losing sight of the bigger picture.
The ideas I’ve pulled together here are pretty condensed as it is, so unfortunately I have no TLDR. I don't claim to have a prophecy to share, or concrete answers to questions about where Bitcoin will go in the future -- nobody does. But that doesn't mean there's nothing to talk about.
I would suggest reading slowly and giving your imagination time to picture or "render" things. There is no other way to grasp Bitcoin.
Final preamble: I know there are people in this sub who are here just for the gains -- they freely admit it, and they laugh at how "true believers" will be left holding the bag when they sell. My hope is that those of you who feel this way will have an open mind. You might see things in a new light, who knows?
Here we go…
The Medium is the Message
In the 1960s, a Canadian professor named Marshall McLuhan became widely known for his thorough analysis of the evolution of communication technologies. His central precept was that communication technologies have dramatic effects on populations regardless of the content they carry at any particular moment. The radio, for example, allowed private microphones to broadcast to widely distributed speakers, which enabled the amplification of private viewpoints on a public scale. This had profound effects on society that played out regardless of what particular messages were carried over particular radio frequencies at particular times.
McLuhan’s famous aphorism, “The Medium is the Message,” is a distillation of this precept. In point form: 1) each new communication technology changes the environment into which it is introduced; and 2) the net effect of a technology over time is both far more interesting and harder to discern than the effect of any particular use of that technology or phase of its development. In other words, it is harder to see the forest for the trees, but seeing the forest is everything.
So: what effect will Bitcoin have on the world over the long run? What is the meaning of Bitcoin?
The Roman Model
To understand where we might be going, we have to first understand how we got to where we are. In the West, our societies are founded on the Classical traditions which were seeded in Ancient Greece and “scaled” so to speak in Ancient Rome. McLuhan had a lot to say about this from a technological point of view:
The development of writing on lightweight media such as papyrus and parchment enabled the externalization of knowledge. Thus, the oral traditions of Ancient Greece were subsumed and replaced by written traditions which were far less lossy and could be refined over time. Writing on lightweight media also enabled the centralized control of vast resources over large distances, which would have been impossible using engraved stone or oral communication. This was perfected by the Romans and thrown into overdrive by Johannes Gutenberg's invention of the printing press around 1450.
In its abstract form, the Roman model takes the form of bureaucracy – hierarchical organization -- and this model has underpinned the structuring of society in the West for the past two thousand years. Look up "org chart" on Google Images if you can't picture one. Our societies are comprised of org charts within org charts within org charts -- try the following searches on Google Images: military org chart, bank org chart, government org chart, university org chart. Everything in our society is centralized, bureaucratized, and nested within the context of the nation state which is run by a central bureaucracy called the government, itself divided into departments within departments, orgs within orgs.
This is not to say that humans didn't organize hierarchically before ancient Rome -- of course they did, as do apes, dogs, chickens, etc. However, in a social hierarchy such as a tribe, there is a scale limit (Dunbar's number, 150) because each member must know his place and his role as well as the places and roles of all other members. The hierarchy lives inside its members' minds and looks more like a swarm than an org chart. Bitcoin is, of course, this type of network, where each node has full knowledge of the state of the network and participates in it voluntarily.
Bureaucracy, on the other hand, is based on the writing down of roles (job descriptions) and makes people interchangeable. There is no limit to scale as long as you map everything out carefully (management). The lifeblood of bureaucracy is the transmission of written forms of information (paper-pushing) from the center to the periphery along defined, linear routes. Each node receives its orders, performs its specialized role, delegates if the role requires it, and then awaits new orders. Privilege and planning are concentrated near the center -- as is risk.
These structures are inherently fragile and collapsible. If you undermine a high-value node as happened in the collapse of Lehman Brothers, the whole edifice collapses. The entire global financial system barely withstood the collapse of a single American bank - it is that fragile.
Each nation's banking system is likewise a matrix of bureaucracies operating as a single, hierarchical supply chain whose product (the national currency) flows outward from a central node (the central bank) through successively less privileged nodes (investment and commercial banks) down to the level of branches and ATMs. At each level of the banking system, additional product is created and loaned out (credit/debt) using the productfrom the level above as a stake (fractional reserve lending). The banking systems are insulated from competition by governments through the decree that taxes must be paid in national currencies. And to keep the currencies moving, everyone is raised from birth to want more and then given the appearance of more through the creation of more by fiat, meaning by arbitrary decree, without any necessary connection to the creation of new wealth. This is inflation: the steady creation of new money to repay debt and keep the show going. It is a Ponzi scheme by design, and it relies the continued "buying-in" of young people in order to survive.
Each national currency has value and utility only by decree and only within that nation's cell in the global mosaic. To move value from one nation to the next requires snaking it through tenuous international pathways, paying entrenched gatekeepers, and exchanging one national currency for another. You have to be somebody to access the banking system. The more somebody you are, the more access you get. It is principally through control of economic access that strong nations bully weaker ones, rich people bully poorer ones. There is tremendous pent up tension in our world as a result. This is where we are.
The Center Cannot Hold
McLuhan predicted that the advent of the electronic age and the emergence of global communication networks would lead to the dissolution of these centralized, bureaucratic structures from the bottom up. He died before the spread of the Internet but described the end result with crystal clarity in his writings. His vision of an interconnected world, which he called the "Global Village," is here now. Every person has the ability to broadcast information to others in their networks over the Internet. If a transmission is perceived as having sufficient value, the receiving people pass it on, and so on. Above a certain threshold of significance, transmissions are repeated by all people to all other people: this is virality and there is nothing that institutions can do to harness or stop it. The Arab Spring for example brought down an array of national governments in a span of months.
Like a rising tide, global communication networks are bringing about an inevitable dissolution of the Roman model all around us: the music industry was upended by Napster; newspapers are being displaced by twitter and blogs; radio stations are being displaced by podcasts; broadcasters are being displaced by Netflix and YouTube; brick-and-mortar stores are being displaced by Amazon and eBay; AirBnb is gobbling up rental supply; traditional transportation services are being displaced by Uber; and now decentralized currencies are coming after centralized ones. Quoting W.B. Yates: “Things fall apart; the center cannot hold; Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world.”
It is important to realize that even though the post-Dot-Com networks like Facebook and eBay were more effective than their institutional predecessors, they are still quite fragile since they are centralized. They can be hacked, compromised, back-doored, subpoenaed, or otherwise shut down. In contrast, a truly decentralized network is perfectly flat and impossible to shut down. The music industry could kill Napster by going after Sean Parker, but it cannot touch BitTorrent. True decentralization, at scale, is one of the principal reasons why Bitcoin is secure: whatever it becomes, it cannot be stopped because there is no center to hold, and nothing to attack.
At this point, I think it makes sense to explain how Bitcoin works, and why it has value. If those questions can't be answered clearly, there's no basis for thinking Bitcoin will disrupt traditional banking. I do, however, think there are very good answers to those questions which I'll try to present below.
Bitcoin and Blockchain
Imagine you live in a pre-historic tribe of ten people. As a group, you need to find a way to keep track of who did what work, and in what quantity. In other words, you need an abstract “work unit” that can be traded for work and held for use in future exchanges. You could use shiny rocks or something else similarly rare, but people would still be able to cheat the system: why do actual work if you can simply go on a hunt in the forest and find new rocks?
One solution is to create a ledger or list that keeps track of how many rocks each person has. If the ledger is the authority on who has what, people would not be able to inflate their balances by introducing new rocks or other work units from outside the system. The problem is, everyone has to trust the keeper of the ledger. If only one entity maintains the ledger, they ultimately control how much money everyone has (banks).
Decentralization is the solution to this problem. You can write down ten copies of the ledger and distribute a copy to each person in the tribe. At the end of the day, everyone could cross-check the transactions that took place with everyone else and a consensus could be formed about who has what without appealing to a central authority.
Eventually, the people might realize that the rocks themselves are unnecessary, and that it is actually the ledger that is important. The rocks, like all currencies, are meant to track work. If a ledger is already doing that, the rocks themselves become extraneous. The actual units of currency are the work units on the ledger. And if everyone agrees to use the same ledger, its work units have value.
The blockchain is that ledger and Bitcoin is its work unit.
Proof of Work
In the illustration above we can see that the utility of a blockchain is that it enables distributed peers to prove to each other that they have done work, and to trade their work units freely without appealing to a trusted intermediary. The obvious next question is: what proof do we have that we can trust the Bitcoin blockchain?
Bitcoin mining is based on a Proof of Work consensus mechanism. To put this as simply as I can, each and every mining node on the network is competing against the rest of the network to generate a small piece of data that proves it has performed an enormous number of computer operations using a batch of new, valid transactions as an input. The amount of work that it takes to successfully mine Bitcoin is dictated by how much computer power has voluntarily joined the mining network - and this is adjusted dynamically as miners enter and leave the network. Each operation requires a tiny bit of electricity since a computer must perform it, so as the difficulty of the Proof of Work operation scales, so too does the cost of generating it.
As of writing, the Bitcoin network is collectively performing about 8,250,000,000,000,000,000 operations per second, and it takes an average of about ten minutes worth of this grind for a single node on the network to successfully produce an acceptable proof of work and add a block of transactions to the blockchain. The winning node is awarded new Bitcoin by including a transaction in its block that credits its own wallet -- now we understand mining.
So you want to be a Bitcoin miner? Let's say you have a powerful gaming computer that can perform about 100,000 Bitcoin computer operations per second (a realistic amount by the way). It would have roughly a 1 in 82.5 quintillion chance of mining a block if you were to enter it into the mining race today. If you had a stack of 1000 of these gaming computers your odds of mining a block would improve to roughly 1 in 82.5 quadrillion. A million of them? 1 in 82.5 billion. Etc. Miners use specialize hardware to perform the computer operations, but the point still stands: it takes a staggering amount of computer power and thus a staggering amount of electricity to "get a word in" on the Bitcoin blockchain.
But let's say you get lucky and are able to generate a proof of work. That proof of work will be tied inexorably to whatever batch of transactions you are trying to add to the blockchain since those transactions were part of the input of the computer operation. Your transactions must be valid or else the rest of the network would reject your work. You wouldn’t be able to double-spend, create Bitcoin by fiat, or spend from balances that you don’t have the keys for. The network would reject your block.
The larger and more distributed the mining network is, the more cost-prohibitive it is to compromise it. In other words: the more people you have checking the ledger from different nations and backgrounds, the harder it is to override the distributed, international consensus. And that is why the Bitcoin blockchain can be trusted. It is audited by the largest computer network ever assembled and requires that an attacker control at least 51% of the network on a sustained basis.
The Open Blockchain
As more and more people use a blockchain, its units (e.g. Bitcoin) become more valuable. As the price of the base unit increases, it becomes more profitable to mine them at the prevailing level of difficulty, so more miners join the network. As more miners join the network, the level of difficulty increases and thus the robustness and security of the network increases. As the robustness of the network increases, it becomes more secure against attackers, so more users and investors are drawn to it. And so the price of the base unit increases. Which draws in more miners. Etc.
The adoption of a blockchain, like the adoption of any currency, is a virtuous circle -- one that Bitcoin has been nurturing successfully for nine years without any existential catastrophes. Bitcoin's heartbeat, the mining of a new block every ten minutes, has not skipped a single beat in nine years. There has not been a successful double-spend in nine years. There has not been a single accounting error in nine years. No balance has been mysteriously wiped off the blockchain in nine years. This track record has been established despite the fact that the blockchain is not protected by a firewall, or an institution, or shielded in a vault. It is not buried underground, or protected by obfuscation. It is out there in the wild of cyberspace for all to see and attack, secured purely by Proof of Work and sheer scale.
Bitcoin itself is valuable because it is the only work unit that can be included in a block of this particular, special blockchain: the open, global, transnational, borderless, censorship-resistant, permissionless, leaderless, most well-known, longest-running, and most-well-capitalized blockchain (credit to andreasma for this and many other insights). Because work units on this blockchain are scarce (per the 21-million cap), having the ability to sign for transfers of Bitcoin on the blockchain is a form of real control over scarce resources.
This is the pivotal point: to the degree that people around the world adopt and learn to trust the Bitcoin blockchain, its work units will have value. And it is Bitcoin's openness in particular that makes it the prime candidate for filling this role. Any computer on the planet can join the mining swarm at any time, just as anyone can join the network as a user, at any time, from any location. Even the Bitcoin development community is open-source and open to new developers provided they can prove their merits.
This is what is meant by The Open Blockchain: the Bitcoin blockchain is accessible everywhere and is open to anyone. It is welcoming. It enables people from different cells in the global mosaic to transact point-to-point, without snaking value through complicated interbank networks, without paying entrenched gatekeepers and intermediaries, and without having to convert from one currency to the next. If a country experiences a currency crisis, Bitcoin is a very real option because it enables people to transfer value out of hot spots and convert it into other currencies. The international monetary system is no match for this technology. Private blockchains are no match either.
Bitcoin’s Monetary Policy
Bitcoin is commonly referred to as "digital gold" since it is designed to function like a precious metal. The creation of new units follows something like the extraction curve of a natural resource. The issuance of new coins was steep at first but will taper off over time through successive “halvings” of the reward that miners receive for creating new blocks. Eventually, the issuance of new coins will approach an asymptotic limit of 21 million coins.
At each "halving", the rate of inflation is effectively cut in half, though it decreases ever so slightly with each new block. The current rate of inflation is about 4%. At the next halving in 2020, the inflation rate will be about 2%. In 2024, 1%. Etc.
The world has never before had access to a truly deflationary asset. Even currencies considered deflationary such as the Japanese Yen are not truly deflationary: the government can print an infinite amount even though deflation in Japan has inertia. Gold is not deflationary: new gold is mined every year. Bitcoin will eventually become truly deflationary, meaning the supply of available Bitcoins will contract year over year consistently. How is this possible, if there is no provision to destroy coins in the protocol?
There is guaranteed to be a year sometime in the future where more coins are lost due to people losing their keys than new coins are created. It will happen. As the miner reward decreases, years like this will become more common. In the distant future, decades will go by where every year is deflationary, and eventually it will be practically impossible for the supply of Bitcoin to not decrease in a given year.
Here is Bitcoin’s golden proposition: because it the first truly deflationary asset, it does not require interest payments or a never-ending influx of greater fools in order to provide a “yield” over the very long run. In the distant future, Bitcoin will have a low but predictable intrinsic expected return approximating its rate of deflation, as long as it remains secure.
When you combine Bitcoin's monetary policy with its robustness through distributed Proof of Work on a planetary scale, you end up with the basis for a global reserve asset more effective than anything else humans have ever had a chance to work with, including gold. Gold is modestly inflationary, it cannot be transmitted over a network, and it must be centrally secured and accounted for. Bitcoin has already obsolesced gold as a reserve technology, let alone Ponzi currencies like the dollar - most just don't know it yet. As people come to really understand Bitcoin’s monetary policy, they will flock to it as a safe haven, especially in troubled economies. If we have another 2008, Bitcoin will be very much in play.
Bitcoin as Money
People argue that Bitcoin's deflationary policy, high fees, and volatility make it ineffective as a medium of exchange. If you can expect a Bitcoin to be more valuable next year, why spend it this year? If it costs $20 in fees to buy a $3 coffee, who will use or accept it? If its value can double in a day, who will set prices in terms of Bitcoin exclusively? The truth is, Bitcoin is not yet ready for mass adoption as a day to day currency or unit of account. Anyone who tells you otherwise is getting ahead of the technology -- but this is temporary.
Just as the early Internet could only handle the transfer of simple text-based content but eventually scaled to allow everyone to stream 4k at the same time, so too Bitcoin will scale. The Lightning Network shows promise in this regard. It will enable and incentivize users to stake their Bitcoin on a second layer where payments are negotiated in a trustless manner between parties, instantly, and merely settled periodically on the blockchain. But even with today’s block congestion and high fees, Bitcoin is already cheaper and more efficient for large transfers of value than the banking system, especially internationally. People transfer hundreds of millions of dollars on the blockchain, securely, today.
Regarding volatility, we are still in the very early phases of adoption. Something like 10-20 million people own Bitcoin worldwide. Because the supply of Bitcoin cannot inflate to accommodate increased adoption, prices will continue to escalate in logarithmic fits and starts as adoption ramps up exponentially. Look up "adoption curve" on Google. We are still in the very early phases of the ramp-up, but eventually the curve will taper off and approach something like stability. We do not know how this will play out or how long it will take, and there will be serious volatility along the way; but if Bitcoin scales into a robust transnational currency trading on thousands or tens of thousands of exchanges worldwide, it will likely become more stable than most national currencies if not all.
Regarding deflation: over time, we will likely see new innovative uses of Bitcoin as a reserve for credit creation. People are clearly willing to operate in systems that use reserve-based lending, and they can work wonderfully: look at what humans accomplished in the 20th century! It is conceivable that Bitcoin could be used as a reserve for distributed, trustless, bank-like networks that issue their own tokens. We may end up using a modestly-inflationary cryptocurrency for day-to-day transactions and investment. There’s no way to know what people will come up with, but they will come up with things. And that is why Bitcoin must stay laser-focused on its role as the de facto reserve currency in the crypto-economy.
A Vision Statement for Bitcoin
Tying everything together: over the course of thousands of years, we have built our societies around the use of hierarchical principles of organization. These structures centralize control and privilege, but also risk. They are fragile. Too big to fail.
The invention and proliferation of the Internet paved the way for the dissolution of these structures, and over the past twenty years we have seen countless examples of entrenched institutions being wiped out by flatter, more effective networks.
Now we are seeing the early evolution of global, distributed, cryptographic value storage and transfer networks which will slowly displace traditional banking systems by offering faster, cheaper, more reliable routes, with better systemic risk profiles, infinitely better security, no access controls, and no entrenched monopolistic privileges over money creation.
Bitcoin was the first mover in this space and remains the incumbent. It is a global, secure, consensus-based currency that was bootstrapped from the ground up by ordinary people volunteering to participate in its development, mining, and use. It has grown exponentially in size since its inception, to the point where it is now upheld by the largest dedicated computer network in the world. Because it is secured principally by its unmatched scale, it is therefore the most secure accounting system in the world, which in turn makes the entries in its ledger the most trustworthy on the planet. If you can sign for a Bitcoin in the network’s eyes, you own it -- and nobody can stop you from owning it or signing for it.
Bitcoin is here, now. It is in the air all around us, accessible over wifi and cellular networks around the globe -- anywhere the Internet touches. The next time you walk down the street, look at the people around you. As they move through the air, displacing it with their bodies, recognize that they are literally wading through the Bitcoin network -- they just don't know it yet.
Suggestions for New People
1) Focus first and foremost on the vision and take an interest in the technology. I have a friend who is talking about putting $20k into Bitcoin, yet only a few nights ago he didn't know that Bitcoin isn't a company, or that a block isn't a single transaction. I have another friend who owns a whole Bitcoin but has never initiated a transaction. A co-worker of mine just bought $100 worth of Bitcoin but doesn't know that a wallet is key management software.
2) Bitcoin is an experiment with no precedent. Nobody knows if it will survive, what it will evolve into, or how it will be used. Even with its long-running track record, nobody can say with prophetic certainty that it won't suffer a catastrophic failure of some kind, so put only as much money into Bitcoin as you can afford to lose. I would offer the following as a good rule of thumb: if you have a negative net worth (meaning your debts exceed your assets) be very cautious with Bitcoin, and at the very least do not increase your debt to buy Bitcoin. If you have a positive net worth, do not go negative to buy Bitcoin. Having said all this, do keep in mind that any currency can suffer a catastrophic failure, including the US Dollar. Remember 2008. Don’t fall for illusions of security. We are all sailing in little boats on a big sea. Diversify.
3) If you believe in Bitcoin, try not to obsess over the value of Bitcoin in fiat terms, as tempting as it is. Try to conceptualize its value on the basis of its potential utility in emerging decentralized networks and look for ways to use it in these new emerging ecosystems. Look up OpenBazaar for example - it could be the new eBay without an eBay acting as an intermediary. I strongly believe that owning Bitcoin is exciting because it sets you up to have a stake in this emerging ecosystem. If your aim is to eventually get your value out of Bitcoin in the form of fiat, you’ll be giving up that stake. If you don't care about having a stake and are here just for the gains, that's perfectly fine too.
4) Learn how to take possession of your private keys. If you don't know what that means or how to do it, learn what it means and how to do it. Until you can say with confidence "I alone own my private keys", you do not actually own Bitcoin and you do not have a stake. Someone else owns it for you. It took me two years of owning Bitcoin before I actually clued in and took control of my own, and that is what forced me to take on the Bitcoin learning curve. The good news is, you can too.
(Edit: formatting)

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